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Thread: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

  1. #21

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Rean View Post
    My money would be on BB. And he has 7 other vivre cards to pick from too (from the SH fleets)!

    I think the highest echelons of the WG probably know about Laugh Tale and everything that's on it, so they would probably not need a vivre card to get there, there's a reason they erased a whole century from history after all! Worst case scenario they can just form a defensive wall of sorts right after Lodestar Island as a blocking mechanism and wait for Luffy and any other pirates there.
    Now we have entered a fascinating discussion!

    I think there's a possibility that indeed the WG knows where Laugh Tale is, but there's also the possibility that One Piece was made a secret to keep it away from the WG, so Imu or the Elder Starts may be after the treasure just as much as any pirate.

    There's also other options, like: maybe the WQ was born as a benign entity, and only got corrupted by the massive powers in its hands later? What if the Ancient Kingdom is actually the real evil, and Joy Boy and the 20 founding families banded together to stop it? Then, once the kingdom was defeated, the 20 (now 19) families enjoyed the power they amassed and betrayed Joy Boy? That would make the Lost Century a conflict of 3 factions, now symbolized by the decadent but originally benign WG, Luffy and Blackbeard.

    I love to speculate on the endgame revelations. I feel the True History will not be a simple story that can be fully predicted due to its many nuances.
    My Wano predictions: All Straw Hats will get fights in Wano, but not in Act 3; There will be 5 acts; The Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Yamato will become a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5 to issue a challenge; We are going to Mary Geoise after Wano.

  2. #22

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Deicide View Post
    If you want some food for thought: Chapter 526 describes in detail how exactly Hancock's secret will be found.

    "When prisoners arrive, they are come throught the other side of these bars. There, they are stripped naked and put in Hell Water, which we boil at 100 degrees in iron pots. That works as sterilization, as well as a baptism bath to enter the prison."

    I have some theories as to why Hancock's past as a slave is not known by the government, especially considering their DFs should be a dead giveaway of their identities, but that's talk for another day.
    I see. Though I don't think Luffy has a strong bond with her compared to other characters. I also don't think we need another rescue arc this late in the story. Though I wouldn't mind exploring more of her past. I guess we have to see what happens.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by DollarScholar View Post
    We have all thought about it. There is a hint that Oda may be setting up for a repeat of Marineford with Sabo instead of Ace.
    The reactions to the conclusion of the revolutionary raid on Marejois suggests that Sabo may have been captured.


    Lets go over the possibilities here:

    1. It's a red herring. Sabo did not end up captured, or if he did he will somehow escape or be used in a prisoner exchange with the revolutionaries. Either way, no Marineford 2 attempted public execution to draw out revolutionaries and Strawhats.

    2. There will be a kind of attempted Marineford 2 from the WG where they try to plan a public execution of Sabo in order to force the revolutionaries and Strawhats into a confrontation on the Marines terms, but it fails for some reason and the results are completely different from Marineford 1.

    3. Oda pulls a literal repeat of Marineford, involving the death of Sabo.


    Now scenario 1 would be good, 2 would depend on the execution but could possibly work, and 3 would in my opinion be terrible and seriously harm the manga in ways that would be hard to recover from.
    Ace was not that appealing character to begin with, and we really don't need Ace 2. Now I'm not saying Marineford was bad, it obviously wasn't, but it's just not going to work with Sabo as Ace 2.0.
    Sabo definitely not captured. There's just no chance of that.
    He and the commanders that were with him definitely got framed for murdering Cobra, that much i can definitely see, and I'm guessing probably kidnapping Vivi, who i'm guessing Sabo & co very likely saved
    as the WG murdered Cobra and tried to get rid of her.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    The revos did act stupid. Declare war? Yeah because they were at peace with CDs until then rofl. And can't they just send a letter or something, invading the best guarded place and CDs would just invite them over for tea to talk things out. And why didn't Dragon go with them? He is a coward like usopp?

    And Oda is going repeat marineford, same way how dressrosa is alabasta 2.0. We had the bad scenario with luffy losing, not the positive scenario with luffy winning.
    https://imgur.com/MyjRSWw

  5. #25

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by uniaka ikuzakas View Post
    The revos did act stupid. Declare war? Yeah because they were at peace with CDs until then rofl. And can't they just send a letter or something, invading the best guarded place and CDs would just invite them over for tea to talk things out. And why didn't Dragon go with them? He is a coward like usopp?
    Because a letter can just be covered up by the govt, but a grand announcement at the most heavily guarded and highest-profile summit in the world cannot really be covered up.

  6. #26

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Rean View Post
    Because a letter can just be covered up by the govt, but a grand announcement at the most heavily guarded and highest-profile summit in the world cannot really be covered up.
    But being so well guarded place made it very likely for their 5 commanders to get captured. Like they expected 5 men to escape for all the marines, CP, admirals just like that after they announce it. Now they have a big loss in terms of their top men.
    https://imgur.com/MyjRSWw

  7. #27

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by uniaka ikuzakas View Post
    But being so well guarded place made it very likely for their 5 commanders to get captured. Like they expected 5 men to escape for all the marines, CP, admirals just like that after they announce it. Now they have a big loss in terms of their top men.
    The idea of the revolutionary attack is exactly to show strenght. If thay can strike at the heart of the World Government, right at their seat of power, they can rally more support to their cause. That’s the purpose of the war declaration.

    It’s early to know if it was a wise decision or not. We have little clue of what actually transpired there or how sucessful the operation was.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Let’s try to piece together what happened at the Reverie?

    We know for sure:
    - Reverie lasts seven days
    - Revolutionaries attacked and tried to recover Kuma in the 4th day of reverie
    - The Warlords were abolished
    - There was an incident after the Reverie ended and while the kings were already leaving
    - Arabasta was directly affected by the incident
    - Sabo did something related to the incident, and something bad happened to him.
    - Someone died
    - There was an assassination attempt
    - The government tried and failed to cover one of the above events
    - Wapol had some additional information to leak
    My Wano predictions: All Straw Hats will get fights in Wano, but not in Act 3; There will be 5 acts; The Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Yamato will become a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5 to issue a challenge; We are going to Mary Geoise after Wano.

  8. #28
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Rean View Post

    I think the highest echelons of the WG probably know about Laugh Tale and everything that's on it, so they would probably not need a vivre card to get there, there's a reason they erased a whole century from history after all! Worst case scenario they can just form a defensive wall of sorts right after Lodestar Island as a blocking mechanism and wait for Luffy and any other pirates there.
    Then why not just buster call it out of existence after Roger started a new era?

    Probably would be the best trick they've played.
    Zik Of The 7 Swords: Vision? What do you know about my vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions, and send the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you. Now ask yourself, Are you ready to see that vision?
    Last.fm

  9. #29

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Laugh Tale definitely has a very special location. Either Sky Island, or Under-Sea Island.
    Every nation gets the government it deserves.---- Joseph de Maistre

  10. #30

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Nilitch View Post
    Laugh Tale definitely has a very special location. Either Sky Island, or Under-Sea Island.
    Or something-else island.

    I mean, we’ve seen an elephant-island, a carnivorous-plant-island, an ovni-island, a mangrove-island...
    Maybe Laugh Tale is a special kind of thing or being we haven’t thought of yet. Maybe it’s an island on the back of a flying creature, or is a gaseous island hidden in the middle of a volcano’s plume, or... really anything.
    My Wano predictions: All Straw Hats will get fights in Wano, but not in Act 3; There will be 5 acts; The Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Yamato will become a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5 to issue a challenge; We are going to Mary Geoise after Wano.

  11. #31

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    I've thought of the "Up is Down" scene from At World's End when it comes to Laugh Tale. Knowing a location isn't the end of it. There might be requirements. Maybe a certain year or season, the way they had to set the Merry up to be ready for the Knock Up stream or the coating for the Sunny.

    It can be simply at a certain location that no one thought to go to. Places like Baltigo can be reach, but no one thought the Rev. Army was there. Or Lodestar, it's not clear if a few or many have been there. Is there something blocking the path?

    Doesn't matter what or where Laugh Tale is. We all know Buggy will be PK.

  12. #32

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    and Sabo's real dad was Whitebeard

  13. #33

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Cockycent View Post
    I've thought of the "Up is Down" scene from At World's End when it comes to Laugh Tale. Knowing a location isn't the end of it. There might be requirements. Maybe a certain year or season, the way they had to set the Merry up to be ready for the Knock Up stream or the coating for the Sunny.<br>
    <br>
    It can be simply at a certain location that no one thought to go to. Places like Baltigo can be reach, but no one thought the Rev. Army was there. Or Lodestar, it's not clear if a few or many have been there. Is there something blocking the path?<br>
    <br>
    Doesn't matter what or where Laugh Tale is. We all know Buggy will be PK.
    Certain year or season could make sense. That could be why people like Roger and Oden think they need to wait 20 years. 20 years is clearly not an arbitrary number, because they sail away from Laugh Tale believing that is how long they need to wait for whoever can make use of the One Piece, be it the new Joyboy, Nika, whoever, etc.

    Funny to note that Oden declares he must wait 20 years for that future in Chapter 958, yet 25 years have passed from that moment he declares he will open Wano's borders to Roger's crew. Yet, it HAS been 20 years since the death of Oden and the end of his era. I'm wondering if whatever is at Laugh Tale explicitly states "20 years after X happens..." where X is a vague prophecy up for one's interpretation like the Joyboy and Nika legends. Maybe the reason they laugh when they get there is because whatever is written on them is so idealistic, it seems ridiculously laughable to them, like "there's no way the world could ever be that way, but good on you, Joyboy, for trying."

    And maybe that's why both Roger and Oden both do or try to do something ridiculous before they die. Roger unveils the mystery of the One Piece and starts the Great Age of Pirates, fundamentally changing the landscape of the world. Oden attempts to open Wano's borders, which would have shaken the foundations of their society. Both of them tried to affect great change in anticipation for the future. Whatever is at Laugh Tale motivated them to open up the world in some way and make space for what is to come.

  14. #34

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    If that happens, hope Dragon and pals are a bit smarter than the former strongest guy and his crew and don't wait for blond ace's head to be put on the cutting log to begin the rescuing mission, while hoping the marines are good sports and don't lower the axe till the scheduled time.
    Curiosity has its own reason for existing

  15. #35
    element freak Logia's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    I'm not sure how to feel about a Marineford 2.0 outside the final arc, as Wano personally feels that way to me already. There was a quote from Oda prior to or during Wano, that mentioned something grander than Marineford will occur. Even though it's likely he wasn't talking about Wano. Despite that, we seem to have more named-deaths in Wano compared to the previous war.

    I don't know the numbers, but I believe the Marineford war had more participants than Wano's current war. Though I think the fodder just stood in the background commentating on the 1-on-1 fights for the most part in Marineford. While we still have those fodder commentating in Wano, it just feels like there's more involvement than just them watching the fights. My memory isn't the best.


    While it feels likely Sabo could end up in a repeat Ace situation in Marineford, I don't think I want to see another moment of Luffy going back to Marineford unless there's enough different beats for the arc to feel fresh. If Sabo (or Hancock) were to be captured, Luffy may have an urge to save him/her (much stronger for Sabo). Though maybe he and/or his crew may not think it's entirely worth it/possible? I'm not sure we've seen the Sunny go way off course before. Outside of half the strawhats moving ahead to Zou. There were a bunch of New World pirates showing up in time during the Marineford War, so maybe they could make it should they choose to go.

  16. #36
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Berry Rich View Post
    Is "pushing out" pain and fatigue the same as curing/healing injuries and ailments? That power of the Paw Fruit is comparable to having anesthetic properties. The damage is there but in Luffy's case, he doesn't feel the damage. And there is bound to be limits to what can be "pushed".


    A learning period is feasible for the next user akin to Sabo eating the Flame Fruit.


    I don't see Kuma living. His story is pointing to being more tragic with each new detail. A fatality happened at the Levely. I don't see Oda killing Luffy's brother again so I'm leaning towards Kuma being that death.
    I don't think it'll happen but reading this make me think of a scenario.


    Sabo is found and chased, now he's trying to fight his way out with a non-responsive Kuma. Vivi is also targetted (I guess by the other members of CP0 or maybe the new CP9) and gets caught up in the big battle (Cobra dies, I just like this theory the more I see it). Green Bull shows up ready to capture/kill Sabo. Other Revolutionary commanders can't do anything. Then Kuma's long thought dead mind overcomes his pacifista programming, knocks a celestial dragon out, and sacrifices himself Ace style to save Sabo (if Oda had the time, nice flashback of Kuma meeting Sabo and them becoming friends within the revolution). Kuma dies. In that occurrence, his paw paw ability respawns in a new fruit. Sabo leaves with it and Vivi, they escape and Vivi later on eats it or Vivi eats it right then and there and sends her and Sabo flying for 3 days.


    Sabo gets blamed for all the deaths (WG burns body to complete the frame job). This is why Dadan reacts the way she does at the newspaper.


    Just like that you get Vivi back with a DF ability.


    That's just me ignoring a lot of other stuff about this Vivi paw paw user idea.
    Zik Of The 7 Swords: Vision? What do you know about my vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions, and send the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you. Now ask yourself, Are you ready to see that vision?
    Last.fm

  17. #37

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    I don't think it'll happen but reading this make me think of a scenario.


    Sabo is found and chased, now he's trying to fight his way out with a non-responsive Kuma. Vivi is also targetted (I guess by the other members of CP0 or maybe the new CP9) and gets caught up in the big battle (Cobra dies, I just like this theory the more I see it). Green Bull shows up ready to capture/kill Sabo. Other Revolutionary commanders can't do anything. Then Kuma's long thought dead mind overcomes his pacifista programming, knocks a celestial dragon out, and sacrifices himself Ace style to save Sabo (if Oda had the time, nice flashback of Kuma meeting Sabo and them becoming friends within the revolution). Kuma dies. In that occurrence, his paw paw ability respawns in a new fruit. Sabo leaves with it and Vivi, they escape and Vivi later on eats it or Vivi eats it right then and there and sends her and Sabo flying for 3 days.


    Sabo gets blamed for all the deaths (WG burns body to complete the frame job). This is why Dadan reacts the way she does at the newspaper.


    Just like that you get Vivi back with a DF ability.


    That's just me ignoring a lot of other stuff about this Vivi paw paw user idea.
    Dude, the hell. I also came to same conclusion. Vivi gonna get Paw Paw fruit. They are/will be in air for 3 days. That's why no communication. I even extended this theory. They gonna land in Wano when the 3 day thing is over.

    I also believe some thing bad/embarassing happened to WG. That's why they wanted to cover up the news. Morgan still published the news.

  18. #38
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Western Ruffy View Post
    Dude, the hell. I also came to same conclusion. Vivi gonna get Paw Paw fruit. They are/will be in air for 3 days. That's why no communication. I even extended this theory. They gonna land in Wano when the 3 day thing is over.

    I also believe some thing bad/embarassing happened to WG. That's why they wanted to cover up the news. Morgan still published the news.
    I just came up with that cuz every now and then its brought up that Vivi is rejoining and she ate the paw paw fruit to fit the # theory.

    Your next step makes it a super coincidence of they happen to land in Wano. Like Vivi doing that with no prior experience and it being by chance is a bit much (unless Sabo somehow gives her some pointers). Somewhere in the New World where the strawhats go next would be enough .
    Zik Of The 7 Swords: Vision? What do you know about my vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions, and send the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you. Now ask yourself, Are you ready to see that vision?
    Last.fm

  19. #39

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    I just came up with that cuz every now and then its brought up that Vivi is rejoining and she ate the paw paw fruit to fit the # theory.

    Your next step makes it a super coincidence of they happen to land in Wano. Like Vivi doing that with no prior experience and it being by chance is a bit much (unless Sabo somehow gives her some pointers). Somewhere in the New World where the strawhats go next would be enough .
    Oda isn't above relying on such coincidences though. Remember Kaido jumping from a Sky Island and landing right next to Kidd, Hawkings and Killer?


  20. #40

    Default Re: Sabo, Ace and Marineford 2.0

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    I just came up with that cuz every now and then its brought up that Vivi is rejoining and she ate the paw paw fruit to fit the # theory.

    Your next step makes it a super coincidence of they happen to land in Wano. Like Vivi doing that with no prior experience and it being by chance is a bit much (unless Sabo somehow gives her some pointers). Somewhere in the New World where the strawhats go next would be enough .
    Well. I was in 'raid gonna fail' camp for few months. It looked like Strawhats needed some sorta back up like Sabo. Also some fan did the numbers calculation for devil fruit strawhats ate. Oda 'slipped' some clues about Paw Paw fruit. I don't remember the exact words. It made sense for Vivi to have the fruit.

    If our prediction ends up true, we gotta do kampai, brother.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by DollarScholar View Post
    Oda isn't above relying on such coincidences though. Remember Kaido jumping from a Sky Island and landing right next to Kidd, Hawkings and Killer?
    Didn't Apoo snitch on their location?

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