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Thread: Yamato’s role in the story.

  1. #101
    Pirate Penguin Clessenur's Avatar
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    It's pretty clear she will join Straw Hats, but what will be her role in the crew? Lookout? Brewer?
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  2. #102

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clessenur View Post
    It's pretty clear she will join Straw Hats, but what will be her role in the crew? Lookout? Brewer?
    I'm most inclined to think bodyguard at this point.

  3. #103
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by electricmastro View Post
    I'm most inclined to think bodyguard at this point.
    That sounds kinda odd for a crew that risks each others life on a daily basis.
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  4. #104

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clessenur View Post
    That sounds kinda odd for a crew that risks each others life on a daily basis.
    Sure but an explicit point has been made this arc that Luffy needs escorts so he can save his energy for the big fights. ANd that Nami and Usopp's usual trap tactics just don't work when there's an a enemy that can get up to them and tear through them.

    Yeah they'll still need to do their solo battles in the final arcs, but having protection won't hurt.

    Apprentice/ cabin boy is probably a better position though. The juxtaposition of being a super tough high end fighter, but with zero sailing experience, feels like an Oda joke.
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  5. #105
    I like videogames TLC's Avatar
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    I assumed it'd be a chronicler of their adventures like Oden.

  6. #106

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Guys, do not forget that characters struggling about leaving or staying is not a new thing in this series.

    Sanji, Chopper and Franky have all went through it. They all felt like they had a duty to achieve by staying, but eventually decided to leave.

    Vivi is the only person who has ever chosen to remain, but that was not due to duty, but because she genuinely loved Arabasta. Yamato, if he's supposed to stay in Wano, has to be out of free will, not because he feels guilty or responsible for Wano because he's some guardian deity of somesuch. What matters is what Yamato wants.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---



    Well, Yamato already proved he has no problem leaving important Wano people behind if it means getting more involved in fights, so an innate sense of protection is unlikely.

    Not to mention Yamato has no real attachment to Wano. He cares about it because it was Oden's country.
    Sanji and Franky yeah, for Chopper, after Wapol was defeated, that was not the reason, his insecurities in regards to being a monster were.

  7. #107
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by TLC View Post
    I assumed it'd be a chronicler of their adventures like Oden.
    This'll be the actual skill while cabin boy is the joke.

    Sort of how Robin is an assassin while also being an archeologist and poneglyph translator.
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  8. #108

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    Sure but an explicit point has been made this arc that Luffy needs escorts so he can save his energy for the big fights. ANd that Nami and Usopp's usual trap tactics just don't work when there's an a enemy that can get up to them and tear through them.

    Yeah they'll still need to do their solo battles in the final arcs, but having protection won't hurt.

    Apprentice/ cabin boy is probably a better position though. The juxtaposition of being a super tough high end fighter, but with zero sailing experience, feels like an Oda joke.
    Yeah, I think a dedicated escort/bodyguard would be appreciated. There was even a specific point made about Luffy needing to conserve power by not defeating too many enemies all at once, before it basically came to Yamato needing hold Kaido off from hurting anyone else after Luffy lost Round 2.


  9. #109

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    So in addition to going out to sea with Luffy, Yamato wants to not be alone, have people who believe in her, and have people who accept her, all while being free. I suppose that lends to a little more potential towards Yamato joining the crew.


  10. #110

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    It'd be funny if it turns out Yamato gets easily seasick.

  11. #111

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    I like Yamato and would want to see more of the character in the future, past Wano.

    Match-up wise, I'd love Yamato to fight Weevil. Two "sons" of Emperors.

  12. #112

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    The fact that Kaidou wants to use "guardian of Wano" as a further chain to hold Yamato there means its all the more reason to break free.

    Like, Yamato is actively fighting AGAINST that role.
    The role as conceived by Kaido, ie a tyrannical Shogun carrying out his will. What if Yamato were simply to pursue on her own conception of the role of Wano's protector, of her own free will?

    One could also argue Yamato outright dismissing any thoughts of remaining on in Wano specifically due to her father would in a sense constitute Yamato yet remaining shackled by her father's influence, as Ace once alluded to -- for whatever odd reason, out of the blue-- in their first meeting; allowing her resentment to sway her decisions.

    That's not an argument for or against Yamato joining, just saying. Whatever guides their decisions in the coming future ( I think she'll leave ), I don't think any bitterness centered around rebellious pushback against Kaidad will necessarily factor into it, one way or the other. Obviously, her experiences have had a hand in shaping her desires and wishes throughout her life, but I don't see her reasoning being defined by opposition to his wishes, tainted in a sense, ie I can't, won't be Wano's protector because that's what HE would've wanted!

    As others have said, it'd be enough to say she'd already have fulfilled her "duties" as Oden/the Mikami as is, that Wano would be in good hands without her having to stick around, that she'd skip ala Oden to pursue her dreams, etc...

  13. #113

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghidorah Guy View Post
    The role as conceived by Kaido, ie a tyrannical Shogun carrying out his will. What if Yamato were simply to pursue on her own conception of the role of Wano's protector, of her own free will?

    One could also argue Yamato outright dismissing any thoughts of remaining on in Wano specifically due to her father would in a sense constitute Yamato yet remaining shackled by her father's influence, as Ace once alluded to -- for whatever odd reason, out of the blue-- in their first meeting; allowing her resentment to sway her decisions.

    That's not an argument for or against Yamato joining, just saying. Whatever guides their decisions in the coming future ( I think she'll leave ), I don't think any bitterness centered around rebellious pushback against Kaidad will necessarily factor into it, one way or the other. Obviously, her experiences have had a hand in shaping her desires and wishes throughout her life, but I don't see her reasoning being defined by opposition to his wishes, tainted in a sense, ie I can't, won't be Wano's protector because that's what HE would've wanted!

    As others have said, it'd be enough to say she'd already have fulfilled her "duties" as Oden/the Mikami as is, that Wano would be in good hands without her having to stick around, that she'd skip ala Oden to pursue her dreams, etc...
    I honestly find it really hard to believe in justifying Yamato staying in Wano at this point for how much she has expressed in wanting to leave after being trapped there for at least 20 years and One Piece in general embracing the concepts of freedom and exploration. Nothing in the story so far inclines me further believe that she'll stay honestly, despite what Kaido said.

  14. #114

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by electricmastro View Post
    I honestly find it really hard to believe in justifying Yamato staying in Wano at this point for how much she has expressed in wanting to leave after being trapped there for at least 20 years and One Piece in general embracing the concepts of freedom and exploration. Nothing in the story so far inclines me further believe that she'll stay honestly, despite what Kaido said.
    Which is completely fair and reasonable. Nothing wrong a little discussion and idle speculation, is there?

    Just saying, never say never; if Oda wanted to unveil new details, take things in another direction, he could.

  15. #115

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghidorah Guy View Post
    The role as conceived by Kaido, ie a tyrannical Shogun carrying out his will. What if Yamato were simply to pursue on her own conception of the role of Wano's protector, of her own free will?
    Because if that were the case, Oda could've easily written him as such. Why not just have Yamato say he wants to be Wano's guardian by his own terms?

    Oda has never really subverted a character's wish before. Even the likes of Sanji and Franky, who tried to act tough and stay behind out of duty, were clearly shown to be interested in leaving because that was exactly what their flashbacks depicted. We knew Sanji wanted to find All Blue and that Franky wanted to create his own ultimate battleship, goals that could only be achieved by setting out.

    It would be weird to have a character who wishes to set out of their home just decide to stay behind. It would go against the general theme of the series where people leave their comfort zones to pursue happiness.

  16. #116

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Because if that were the case, Oda could've easily written him as such. Why not just have Yamato say he wants to be Wano's guardian by his own terms?

    Oda has never really subverted a character's wish before. Even the likes of Sanji and Franky, who tried to act tough and stay behind out of duty, were clearly shown to be interested in leaving because that was exactly what their flashbacks depicted. We knew Sanji wanted to find All Blue and that Franky wanted to create his own ultimate battleship, goals that could only be achieved by setting out.

    It would be weird to have a character who wishes to set out of their home just decide to stay behind. It would go against the general theme of the series where people leave their comfort zones to pursue happiness.
    And that if it resulted that Yamato decided to stay in Wano, it might risk having all the previous panels mentioning of wanting to leave Wano and disappointment of not being able to leave with Ace be a waste of time.

  17. #117
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    The whole Yamato staying is just a bad idea by ppl who are not thinking it through. They just leave the rest up to Its to somehow make it good writing while they ignore everything Oda has set up that points down the clearly stated path.

    Similar to why some ppl think Yamato will drop the whole Oden thing when that why really isn't anything Oda has presented as an issue that needs to be addressed or dealt with.

    It's a baseless sort of prediction that ignores themes and the storytelling.
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  18. #118

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    Similar to why some ppl think Yamato will drop the whole Oden thing when that why really isn't anything Oda has presented as an issue that needs to be addressed or dealt with.
    Well Orochi and Kaido killing a big hope for Wano by killing Oden is an issue, and the frustration and tears Yamato had seems to have led her to conclude that Oden's will must be carried on in the aftermath of his murder and her best solution she came up with was dressing up as him, using his name as an alternate name, attempting to live up to his expectations, and be heroic like the hero he was as opposed to staying more true to herself, in addition to wanting freedom like how he had. If Yamato's motivations for being Oden are to free Wano and herself, then why at that point should the plot demand that she still be Oden after gaining freedom for Wano and herself?


  19. #119

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Because if that were the case, Oda could've easily written him as such. Why not just have Yamato say he wants to be Wano's guardian by his own terms?
    Because it's simply something that Oda could always address later? Hypothetically speaking, say something that naturally comes about upon Yamato mingling with the people of the mainland once more, realizing they're still needed there? And for that matter, who says it need become Yamato's permanent status quo? For all we know, Oda could always pull a Jinbe or some such with her, depicting her staying behind to help the people of Wano rebuild until setting out to pursue her dream at a later point in time, be it on her own or eventually joining the Strawhats at some later stage?

    Again, not saying that will happen, something I believe will happen, but just saying: it's always good to keep an open mind.

    Oda has never really subverted a character's wish before.
    You mean Strawhat crewmember's wishes, because it's certainly happened before with others.

    Besides which, that means everything set in stone? That Oda will never change things up, has nothing else to say on the nature of the pursuit of dreams? I bet he does, and I'm banking on it. Whether Yamato's storyline falls within this scope is another matter, but anywho; we've been given plenty indications already imo that one's dreams and desires in the world of One Piece aren't exempt from being subject to change, to being placed on the backburner, or coming to fruition in other forms, even those one may not initially expect. And that in itself falls squarely under one of the guiding core philosophies of One Piece, as I see it: there are no absolutes.

    As such, more to the discussion at hand ( and really, tying into the entire Wano narrative as a whole ), one shouldn't rush to conclusions based on fixed perceptions of patterns, surefire odds, fate, prophecies, and the like, because that is precisely the overall point I see Oda pushing overall, as well as a sign of things to come.

    For instance, let's talk about Tama. Because if we're to take precedent as dogma, that means it's she who's set to become the next crewmember, having received the female-specific MARK OF THE CHOSEN ONE, ie Luffy placing his strawhat on her head. And she's one with her own stated dream too. So that means no room for Yamato, sorry guys, Strawhats have never had two new members join at the same time, not happening.

    Naaaah.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by electricmastro View Post
    And that if it resulted that Yamato decided to stay in Wano, it might risk having all the previous panels mentioning of wanting to leave Wano and disappointment of not being able to leave with Ace be a waste of time.
    One could say the same with respect to Tama, no?

    Apart from that, this need not necessarily be the case, for a number of a reasons...again, hypothetically speaking. For one, the arc has yet to even conclude, so it's too soon to make such calls, as we've yet to have access the the complete picture. While some readers may deem these scenes to be a waste of time per this scenario, that doesn't preclude the possibility of Oda himself having a different view of it, of having intended these sequences to serve some other purpose that'd ultimately become clearer as the story unfolds and wraps up.

    But again, I'll keep repeating for clarification: not a definite by any means, and not what I see happening myself.


    Quote Originally Posted by electricmastro View Post
    Well Orochi and Kaido killing a big hope for Wano by killing Oden is an issue, and the frustration and tears Yamato had seems to have led her to conclude that Oden's will must be carried on in the aftermath of his murder and her best solution she came up with was dressing up as him, using his name as an alternate name, attempting to live up to his expectations, and be heroic like the hero he was as opposed to staying more true to herself, in addition to wanting freedom like how he had. If Yamato's motivations for being Oden are to free Wano and herself, then why at that point should the plot demand that she still be Oden after gaining freedom for Wano and herself?

    https://i.ibb.co/tPf1g99/Screen-Shot...6-53-57-PM.png
    While it need not be something that has to be addressed, I do think it will be, as it'd tie into the presiding themes of Identity and Role currently at play, in tune with some prevalent overarching themes at hand.

    Me, I personally foresee the endgoal of Yamato's character arc being Yamato's realization that they need not in some literal, exact sense be Oden in order to simply live up to his example and ideals, fulfill his role, and carry on his legacy. By the same token -- and this might be a point of controversy -- this will extend to his gender as well, in that Yamato need not need identity as a man because Oden happened to be a man.

    That said, I'm also expecting ( though not guaranteed, of course ) that Oda will cap off the gender topic once and for all by directly proceeding to cement that Yamato has either always identified as male prior to Oden's influence or, perhaps more fittingly, will simply declare that they yet remain a man because that is what Yamato chooses to identify as of his own free will, independent of any association with Oden's role; remains to be seen, of course.

    Overall idea and message I believe Oda intends to convey here through Yamato ( for one ) is that one need not, should not, be compelled to arbitrarily adhere to some exact checklist of prerequisites when taking up a cause, following one's will, etc...nor should others expect as much, as we the readers and the characters are sure to learn soon enough in future cases imo. As mentioned before, all falls within the parameters of the themes of Anti-Absolutism and Freedom of Choice.

    All that said, I could always see Oda going another alternate route as well, though one that need not clash with the above: Yamato still holding on to the Oden identity, albeit to a more toned down extent. Really, it'd be little different from what's already been established previously; as others have already pointed, Yamato identification as Oden has never really excluded his identification as Yamato either. The long-running themes of identity, role, coming to terms with one's past/origins, legacy, embracing everything....Oda's been gradually interweaving these and will continue to do so going forward, so this could ultimately culminate with Yamato ( and others ) declaring or adopting a mentality along the lines of something like this:

    I am "Oden"...I am "Kaido"...I am oni and samurai ( or whatever else )...I am man and woman..,but above all, I am me.

    That's the very rough gist of it: Yamato no longer proclaiming to be Oden per se, but not exactly discarding the identity altogether...Yamato being Oden but also not Oden...
    an acknowledgment that all these various elements and figures may have shaped Yamato to an extent, but no one piece defines them either, which is the thematic point being made. I imagine we'll also see this play out in sync with other characters like Sanj, Zoro, and others coming to terms with their own pasts, particularly as it pertains to Sanji's current ongoing struggles to reconcile his Germa background...and humanity. No coinydink there.

    Above all else, I fully believe Taoist philosophy, Quantum Mechanics, and other such related schools of thought run at the heart of One Piece overall, and that's what further colors my reasoning here; Yamato is just one of many other examples we'll be seeing ( and have seen already ) of functional paradoxes at work. And this will further underscore everything else to come.
    Who knows? Saw someone propose the idea that Yamato may adopt a new name altogether. Can't rule that out as a possibility either, and would mesh with everything I've outlined. One could say Oda' already planted the seeds with the whole Pirate/Ninja/Samurai/Mink Alliance gag.

    "I am ______ aka Oden aka Yamato, son of Oden/Daughter of Kaido/ samurai oni pirate yadda yadda"

    On a somewhat related note, it also jives with my own theory of what the D may actually stand for...an abbreviation of a very, very long string of existing or suggested names that the collective D clan members of long ago agreed to combine together because the stubborn idiots couldn't agree on any any one particular designated name. All this time, fans have been wracking their brains over what the D specifically stands for, the mystery behind the supposed secrecy, when the answer may be that it doesn't stand for any one word, and the clan name was abbreviated out of practical necessity :\/

    But yeah, that's my piece.

  20. #120

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghidorah Guy View Post
    Because it's simply something that Oda could always address later? Hypothetically speaking, say something that naturally comes about upon Yamato mingling with the people of the mainland once more, realizing they're still needed there? And for that matter, who says it need become Yamato's permanent status quo? For all we know, Oda could always pull a Jinbe or some such with her, depicting her staying behind to help the people of Wano rebuild until setting out to pursue her dream at a later point in time, be it on her own or eventually joining the Strawhats at some later stage?

    Again, not saying that will happen, something I believe will happen, but just saying: it's always good to keep an open mind.
    The problem is, as many people have stated previously, is that why would Oda just....spend the greater part of the year, planning and writing and drawing all these things building up to Yamato joining and then...toss it into a bin for...what exactly? He's a good enough author to pen down his intent on paper, and there has been 0 indication that yamato wants to or needs to stay.
    There's nothing to keep an open mind about when the author himself is stating the facts as explicitly as he can. Like i'm not going to entertain perona or hancock arguments for nakama just because "it's good to keep an open mind and Oda can change tack whenever he wants". Sorry for being blunt, but that's just a way to justify fanfic as a possibility (it doesn't work that way when there's no text, even subtext supporting it).

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghidorah Guy View Post
    Besides which, that means everything set in stone? That Oda will never change things up, has nothing else to say on the nature of the pursuit of dreams? I bet he does, and I'm banking on it. Whether Yamato's storyline falls within this scope is another matter, but anywho; we've been given plenty indications already imo that one's dreams and desires in the world of One Piece aren't exempt from being subject to change, to being placed on the backburner, or coming to fruition in other forms, even those one may not initially expect. And that in itself falls squarely under one of the guiding core philosophies of One Piece, as I see it: there are no absolutes.

    As such, more to the discussion at hand ( and really, tying into the entire Wano narrative as a whole ), one shouldn't rush to conclusions based on fixed perceptions of patterns, surefire odds, fate, prophecies, and the like, because that is precisely the overall point I see Oda pushing overall, as well as a sign of things to come.

    For instance, let's talk about Tama. Because if we're to take precedent as dogma, that means it's she who's set to become the next crewmember, having received the female-specific MARK OF THE CHOSEN ONE, ie Luffy placing his strawhat on her head. And she's one with her own stated dream too. So that means no room for Yamato, sorry guys, Strawhats have never had two new members join at the same time, not happening.

    Naaaah.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---



    One could say the same with respect to Tama, no?
    Yes. Oda has always been super explicit about the whole dreams matter, from how a person's will/dreams continues to exist past their mortal selfs or whether a villain who's dreams have been crushed no longer have a "stake" per say to fight for. There's a very clear belief that the strawhats will achieve their dreams clearly at the end of the series, whether it's shown at the final conflict or as an epilogue. And that every single SH's dreams have remained super consistent from the moment of their declaration to the current moment so i'm really not sure what you've even talking about here.

    Also there's probably a grand total of 1 person vocally pushing for tama in these forums (from what i see) and even they don't use "strawhat on my head" as an argument or have a dream (she has a dream other than to see wano be free?). So that's completely irrelevant to whatever you're trying to argue (plus the fact she's 8).

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