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Thread: Yamato’s role in the story.

  1. #81

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    I get the impression the fruit being that of Wano’s guardian was mentioned so as to keep people guessing if Yamato will join the Straw Hats or not.

    Last edited by electricmastro; August 1st, 2021 at 09:19 AM.

  2. #82

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    The fact that Kaidou wants to use "guardian of Wano" as a further chain to hold Yamato there means its all the more reason to break free.

    Like, Yamato is actively fighting AGAINST that role.
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  3. #83

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    I haven't checked, but I think this is the first time that a DF has been linked to a specific location. It's called the "Guardian Spirit" of that location. We know that Momo is heading back to the roof (Momotaro and all that) and it's possible that he'll recognize the "Guardian Spirit" of his country. If he does, then that would make him more likely to ask Yamato to stay to and "Protect Wano." It wouldn't be for Kaido. It would be for the country that Yamato wants to free. That's where my mind is.

    I've said that it's possible that Yamato could stay but didn't have a solid reason why. This reveal makes that more possible. Having the "Guardian Spirit of Wano" sailing around doing anything but protecting Wano sounds weird. If the fruit wasn't linked to the country itself, I wouldn't think twice about it. We know Marco and Luffy won't be sticking around after the arc to protect the country. If they all left (including Yamato), then that would be a huge departure from the Momotaro story. Fair or not, it feel likes at least one of them would have to stay based on the story.

  4. #84

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    I haven't checked, but I think this is the first time that a DF has been linked to a specific location. It's called the "Guardian Spirit" of that location. We know that Momo is heading back to the roof (Momotaro and all that) and it's possible that he'll recognize the "Guardian Spirit" of his country. If he does, then that would make him more likely to ask Yamato to stay to and "Protect Wano." It wouldn't be for Kaido. It would be for the country that Yamato wants to free. That's where my mind is.

    I've said that it's possible that Yamato could stay but didn't have a solid reason why. This reveal makes that more possible. Having the "Guardian Spirit of Wano" sailing around doing anything but protecting Wano sounds weird. If the fruit wasn't linked to the country itself, I wouldn't think twice about it. We know Marco and Luffy won't be sticking around after the arc to protect the country. If they all left (including Yamato), then that would be a huge departure from the Momotaro story. Fair or not, it feel likes at least one of them would have to stay based on the story.
    I mean, Yamato still desired to sail out of Wano with Luffy, so maybe the fruit isn’t obligating her to stay or anything like that. Not sure what what exactly would lead Momo to think that Yamato should stay and deny her wish to sail out. It could even go back to when Garp told Luffy he should be a marine, but went against that wish in favor of going off on his own and doing what he wanted, and somehow I don’t think the Wano guardian background Kaido mentioned with the fruit should get in Yamato’s way either.

  5. #85

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    I'll say it now: Yamato staying in Wano only cause an involuntary eaten fruit links him to the place would be no less constraining than Kaido imposing his "be the shogun" will.

    I also add that imho there have to be a really strong reason to makes Yamato stay without it not resembling an explicitly antagonist reason as Kaido's will.
    Quote Originally Posted by rayleigh92 View Post
    Carrot sneaked on the Sunny when they left Zou, not asking or requesting anyone. IF Carrot is going to join, I expect something like that, with the crew ready to leave Wano, all of them beginning to party for new nakama Yamato and then "wha-t?! Carrot is near Luffy

  6. #86

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    I haven't checked, but I think this is the first time that a DF has been linked to a specific location. It's called the "Guardian Spirit" of that location. We know that Momo is heading back to the roof (Momotaro and all that) and it's possible that he'll recognize the "Guardian Spirit" of his country. If he does, then that would make him more likely to ask Yamato to stay to and "Protect Wano." It wouldn't be for Kaido. It would be for the country that Yamato wants to free. That's where my mind is.

    I've said that it's possible that Yamato could stay but didn't have a solid reason why. This reveal makes that more possible. Having the "Guardian Spirit of Wano" sailing around doing anything but protecting Wano sounds weird. If the fruit wasn't linked to the country itself, I wouldn't think twice about it. We know Marco and Luffy won't be sticking around after the arc to protect the country. If they all left (including Yamato), then that would be a huge departure from the Momotaro story. Fair or not, it feel likes at least one of them would have to stay based on the story.
    Don't forget Chaka and Pell named the Jackal and the Falcon "guardian spirits" of Arabasta.

    This is not the first time we saw something like this.
    My Wano predictions: All Straw Hats will get fights in Wano, but not in Act 3; There will be 5 acts; The Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Yamato will become a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5 to issue a challenge; We are going to Mary Geoise after Wano.

  7. #87

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by rayleigh92 View Post
    I'll say it now: Yamato staying in Wano only cause an involuntary eaten fruit links him to the place would be no less constraining than Kaido imposing his "be the shogun" will.

    I also add that imho there have to be a really strong reason to makes Yamato stay without it not resembling an explicitly antagonist reason as Kaido's will.
    Then again, I suppose Kaido choosing to telling Yamato that she should stay to become Wano’s protector could imply that she is actually able to leave Wano, and that Kaido felt it necessary to convince her to stay, and that the fruit isn’t something like a force field obligating her to stay there.

  8. #88

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    It seems like most people have assumed that Yamato "sailing out to sea" with Luffy has only one interpretation and that's to join as a SH and leave Wano immediately after the arc. There are other ways to view "sailing out to sea" with Luffy, however. He can leave immediately after the arc and board the Sunny, but not as a SH. That would still count as "sailing out to sea" with Luffy. Another, less thought of one is to stay in Wano, give Luffy a vivre card like he did with Ace, and then do the whole "sailing out to sea" with Luffy as part of the fleet at the end of the series. Now, I'm not saying specifically which one will happen, but all of those would count as "sailing out to sea" with Luffy. It's just that most people have assumed the first and not considered any of the others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deicide View Post
    Don't forget Chaka and Pell named the Jackal and the Falcon "guardian spirits" of Arabasta.

    This is not the first time we saw something like this.
    I did consider that, but I don't recall it being specifically stated and was too lazy to re-read the whole arc. Lol
    Last edited by BobLoblaw; August 1st, 2021 at 10:07 AM.

  9. #89
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Considering Wano Kuni will be the nation that fights against the rule of the World Government once the borders are open, the role of Wano's "Guardian" will extend toward that battle which is encapsulated through the journey the Straw Hat Pirates are currently on.

    Beautifully done, Oda-sensei. What a romantic path for a character to follow.

  10. #90

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    I haven't checked, but I think this is the first time that a DF has been linked to a specific location. It's called the "Guardian Spirit" of that location. We know that Momo is heading back to the roof (Momotaro and all that) and it's possible that he'll recognize the "Guardian Spirit" of his country. If he does, then that would make him more likely to ask Yamato to stay to and "Protect Wano." It wouldn't be for Kaido. It would be for the country that Yamato wants to free. That's where my mind is.

    I've said that it's possible that Yamato could stay but didn't have a solid reason why. This reveal makes that more possible. Having the "Guardian Spirit of Wano" sailing around doing anything but protecting Wano sounds weird. If the fruit wasn't linked to the country itself, I wouldn't think twice about it. We know Marco and Luffy won't be sticking around after the arc to protect the country. If they all left (including Yamato), then that would be a huge departure from the Momotaro story. Fair or not, it feel likes at least one of them would have to stay based on the story.
    It's just a DF though. It shouldn't really dictate what characters should be or do.

    Reminder that Oden was being set as the next shogun of Wano and had his own responsibilities as a feudal lord, but abandoned that to sail around the world.

    In fact, I actually could see Momo and co. asking Yamato to stay, only for Yamato to change mind in the last second because that would be "Oden".
    Last edited by King Cannon; August 1st, 2021 at 10:27 AM.

  11. #91

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    At any rate, Yamato definitely seems to be shaping up to gaining some warrior/guard sort of role, being the character to possibly have the most experience in fighting against Kaido despite not winning.


  12. #92

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    It's just a DF though. It shouldn't really dictate what characters should be or do.

    Reminder that Oden was being set as the next shogun of Wano and had his own responsibilities as a feudal lord, but abandoned that to sail around the world.

    In fact, I actually could see Momo and co. asking Yamato to stay, only for Yamato to change mind in the last second because that would be "Oden".
    It's not "just a DF," though. That's what we see 99.9% of the time. This is a mythical fruit tied directly to the country and is said to be it's "Spirit Guardian." There's significance to that. I don't think it's a throwaway line by Kaido. As such, it would be really unusual to see the "Spirit Guardian" of a country ditching the country asap to go off and do their own thing. I'm not saying it's an "inherited will" thing. It would just be odd. Of course, Oda-sensei does "odd" better than anyone.

  13. #93

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    It's not "just a DF," though. That's what we see 99.9% of the time. This is a mythical fruit tied directly to the country and is said to be it's "Spirit Guardian." There's significance to that. I don't think it's a throwaway line by Kaido. As such, it would be really unusual to see the "Spirit Guardian" of a country ditching the country asap to go off and do their own thing. I'm not saying it's an "inherited will" thing. It would just be odd. Of course, Oda-sensei does "odd" better than anyone.
    What would that entail though? A force field so that the user can’t leave?

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    I did consider that, but I don't recall it being specifically stated and was too lazy to re-read the whole arc. Lol
    Spoiler:




  14. #94

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by electricmastro View Post
    What would that entail though? A force field so that the user can’t leave?
    Nothing crazy like that. Maybe some innate sense to protect it? I don't know. Yamato has said he's willing to die to protect Momo and he wants to help the samurai and protect Wano from Kaido. Again, nothing too definitive, but it's not like Yamato would be somehow doomed if he ended up protecting Wano and its people. It's what he said he wants to do. It just wouldn't line up with his "sailing out to sea" statements.


    Thanks! So I guess there is precedent in story. It doesn't mean that he is somehow bound to the country, but he does seem to be keen on protecting it. Alabasta representing Egypt and it's mythical protectors (Horus and Anubis) would parallel Wano representing Japan and a mythical protector. Of course, their fruits weren't said to be mythical, so there's still a slight difference on that, but not the overall symbolism.

  15. #95

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Guys, do not forget that characters struggling about leaving or staying is not a new thing in this series.

    Sanji, Chopper and Franky have all went through it. They all felt like they had a duty to achieve by staying, but eventually decided to leave.

    Vivi is the only person who has ever chosen to remain, but that was not due to duty, but because she genuinely loved Arabasta. Yamato, if he's supposed to stay in Wano, has to be out of free will, not because he feels guilty or responsible for Wano because he's some guardian deity of somesuch. What matters is what Yamato wants.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    Nothing crazy like that. Maybe some innate sense to protect it? I don't know. Yamato has said he's willing to die to protect Momo and he wants to help the samurai and protect Wano from Kaido. Again, nothing too definitive, but it's not like Yamato would be somehow doomed if he ended up protecting Wano and its people. It's what he said he wants to do. It just wouldn't line up with his "sailing out to sea" statements.
    Well, Yamato already proved he has no problem leaving important Wano people behind if it means getting more involved in fights, so an innate sense of protection is unlikely.

    Not to mention Yamato has no real attachment to Wano. He cares about it because it was Oden's country.
    Last edited by King Cannon; August 1st, 2021 at 02:13 PM.

  16. #96

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    Nothing crazy like that. Maybe some innate sense to protect it? I don't know. Yamato has said he's willing to die to protect Momo and he wants to help the samurai and protect Wano from Kaido. Again, nothing too definitive, but it's not like Yamato would be somehow doomed if he ended up protecting Wano and its people. It's what he said he wants to do. It just wouldn't line up with his "sailing out to sea" statements.


    Thanks! So I guess there is precedent in story. It doesn't mean that he is somehow bound to the country, but he does seem to be keen on protecting it. Alabasta representing Egypt and it's mythical protectors (Horus and Anubis) would parallel Wano representing Japan and a mythical protector. Of course, their fruits weren't said to be mythical, so there's still a slight difference on that, but not the overall symbolism.
    Well Chaka was keen on protecting Alabasta from Crocodile by the time he said that. I’m sure Yamato also wants Wano to stay safe, but is also willing to believe in Momo and the others enough to keep it safe in leading it to the dawn, and leave Wano reassured with that in mind.

  17. #97

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Guys, do not forget that characters struggling about leaving or staying is not a new thing in this series.

    Sanji, Chopper and Franky have all went through it. They all felt like they had a duty to achieve by staying, but eventually decided to leave.

    Vivi is the only person who has ever chosen to remain, but that was not due to duty, but because she genuinely loved Arabasta. Yamato, if he's supposed to stay in Wano, has to be out of free will, not because he feels guilty or responsible for Wano because he's some guardian deity of somesuch. What matters is what Yamato wants.
    I don't think the struggle has been introduced yet. It just seems that one is coming now that we know more about the fruit and Kaido of all people giving us the history lesson. We heard Yamato's desires (or were they Oden's?) to sail and there hasn't been a counterbalance introduced yet. It's possible now that Momo is coming back, so we'll have to see. I don't think anyone would want to see Yamato forced to do anything. That's been his entire life. IF he ultimately ends up staying it will be his choice 100%, fruit or not.

    Well, Yamato already proved he has no problem leaving important Wano people behind if it means getting more involved in fights, so an innate sense of protection is unlikely.

    Not to mention Yamato has no real attachment to Wano. He cares about it because it was Oden's country.
    Wano is the closest thing that Yamato has to a homeland. If he was as detached as you make it seem, then he wouldn't care one way or another about its fate, which clearly he does. He has to care about beyond it just being Oden's country. Besides, Oda-sensei is definitely playing up the symbolism and mythical elements.
    Spoiler:


  18. #98

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    I don't think the struggle has been introduced yet. It just seems that one is coming now that we know more about the fruit and Kaido of all people giving us the history lesson. We heard Yamato's desires (or were they Oden's?) to sail and there hasn't been a counterbalance introduced yet. It's possible now that Momo is coming back, so we'll have to see. I don't think anyone would want to see Yamato forced to do anything. That's been his entire life. IF he ultimately ends up staying it will be his choice 100%, fruit or not.


    Wano is the closest thing that Yamato has to a homeland. If he was as detached as you make it seem, then he wouldn't care one way or another about its fate, which clearly he does. He has to care about beyond it just being Oden's country. Besides, Oda-sensei is definitely playing up the symbolism and mythical elements.
    Exact mythology doesn't mean much. Chinese dragons are symbols of wisdom, which Kaido is anything but.

    Plus, by the end of the arc, there won't be local demons anymore. And if Momo does become a huge ass dragon as it is being foreshadowed, then Yamato being around will be irrelevant.

  19. #99
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    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post

    I've said that it's possible that Yamato could stay but didn't have a solid reason why. This reveal makes that more possible. Having the "Guardian Spirit of Wano" sailing around doing anything but protecting Wano sounds weird. If the fruit wasn't linked to the country itself, I wouldn't think twice about it. We know Marco and Luffy won't be sticking around after the arc to protect the country. If they all left (including Yamato), then that would be a huge departure from the Momotaro story. Fair or not, it feel likes at least one of them would have to stay based on the story.
    Weirder than the the next shogun of Wano leaving Wano to be a Whitebeard pirate and then joining the Roger pirates?

    Nope pretty clear where Oda is going with Yamato.

    But if we're doing this for the first time somebody needs to protect the place Luffy just saved/liberated then I guess Marco is staying in Wano.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by BobLoblaw View Post
    It's not "just a DF," though. That's what we see 99.9% of the time. This is a mythical fruit tied directly to the country and is said to be it's "Spirit Guardian." There's significance to that. I don't think it's a throwaway line by Kaido. As such, it would be really unusual to see the "Spirit Guardian" of a country ditching the country asap to go off and do their own thing. I'm not saying it's an "inherited will" thing. It would just be odd. Of course, Oda-sensei does "odd" better than anyone.
    It would be no different or weirder than Oden ditching the country.

    This seems to be a very weak reason to think Yamato must stay on Wano.
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  20. #100

    Default Re: Yamato’s role in the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Exact mythology doesn't mean much. Chinese dragons are symbols of wisdom, which Kaido is anything but.

    Plus, by the end of the arc, there won't be local demons anymore. And if Momo does become a huge ass dragon as it is being foreshadowed, then Yamato being around will be irrelevant.
    Kaido may not represent wisdom, but Momo might. As for mythology itself, we see the tale of Momotaro playing out right now. I don't think anything mythological should be categorically disregarded at this point. OP as a series has had a ton of symbolism along with an overlap of history and mythology.

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