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Thread: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

  1. #4621

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    The red actually looks good on Trunks. Maybe because its not launching his hair up into a weird haircut so he looks like an actual character.
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  2. #4622
    Just badass Sano's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    20 years ago yesterday, Was when the english dub of Dragon Ball Z cover Goku transformation into a Super Saiyan for the first time. Even though, I started became a fan of Dragon Ball back in 1998 during Cartoon Network's original run of Dragon Ball Z Season 1 and 2 with the Ocean Group cast (the first actual episode I watch was when Krillin, Gohan, and Piccolo trying to fight Nappa until Goku arrives after the couple hours break).

    All I have to say so much have change since those Season 3 vhs tapes came out. I remember I went to Sam Goody's since I mostly was started collecting DBZ vhs tapes a few months before the Season 3 tapes started coming out, I was collecting the Namek episodes (At the time, I had up to point of the Vegeta vs. Zarbon, Round 2). One day, I went Sam Goody's I saw these new tapes that I never seen before (This was way before I had the internet and I didn't even knew about the Season 3 tapes were coming out and stuff.)

    Of course I picked up the two tapes (Assault and Double Cross, I had the edited version), I didn't know what to expect when I heard voice replacement for the first time. I was somewhat confused, but it was few months later that I found out about voice cast change and about the uncut vhs tapes (Which I started getting the uncut vhs starting with Freeza: The Summoning and Freeza: Transformation.).

    Collecting the vhs tapes at the time was fun, since during the break in the middle of Season 3 on tv, we were getting new episodes on vhs with the Garlic Jr and Trunks episodes. I still remember seeing the Trunks trailer on the first Garlic Jr tape and made me can't wait to see what's coming in the future of Dragon Ball dub.
    Last edited by Sano; October 18th, 2019 at 10:54 PM.

  3. #4623

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    New chapter's out.

    This went the expected route of pre-established thugs coming to Earth to fight the non-Goku/Vegeta characters. They even go in-depth with one of these thugs and present him in a properly menacing way. Not bad, to be honest.

    Spoiler:
    That said, a bit sad Piccolo lost so clearly. The way he let seven-three grab his neck was very sloppy, as he himself admitted. Also, this might be a little nitpicky, but the extending arms thing should not be used in a close-quarters fight choreography, cause it looks like two awkward flailing arms. Aside from that, I guess Gohan will take care of seven-three. Krillin is still not out of the picture, I hope, and it almost seems like they want to do something with Jaco and his self-confidence?


    Anyways, not bad, the fact an entire chapter is almost free of Goku and Vegeta except for the last two pages is a nice change of pace.

  4. #4624

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    I like that because the mook copied Piccolo's techniques at Piccolo's own strength and in that situation smart fighting above strong fighting would be the way to victory, we might be getting the first fight in forever that might have Piccolo actually struggling.

    I see a bunch of complaining that Piccolo is making mistakes around, but I welcome that because it shows that his greatest strengths are still fallible and he has room for improvement: there is a chance his hearing and perception could fail him, no matter how good it is.

    I actually liked Piccolo losing because of not noticing his opponent in the anime ToP because of this, too. In fact a bunch of the characters' losses in the ToP established ways they could improve. There is always someone better out there, after all.

    That said, the other side to this is that Dragon Ball often just throws the characters away instead of spinning it this way.

    I kind of want Gohan's powers to be copied so it would be a tougher challenge for him, too.

    It's entirely possible they'll just be smacked around and lose here and I think the mooks' designs are distractingly derivative and not that good, but this arc has some really nice scenarios set up and I really hope they'll be taken advantage of in a interesting way.

  5. #4625

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Kizuchan View Post
    I like that because the mook copied Piccolo's techniques at Piccolo's own strength and in that situation smart fighting above strong fighting would be the way to victory, we might be getting the first fight in forever that might have Piccolo actually struggling.

    I see a bunch of complaining that Piccolo is making mistakes around, but I welcome that because it shows that his greatest strengths are still fallible and he has room for improvement: there is a chance his hearing and perception could fail him, no matter how good it is.

    I actually liked Piccolo losing because of not noticing his opponent in the anime ToP because of this, too. In fact a bunch of the characters' losses in the ToP established ways they could improve. There is always someone better out there, after all.

    That said, the other side to this is that Dragon Ball often just throws the characters away instead of spinning it this way.

    I kind of want Gohan's powers to be copied so it would be a tougher challenge for him, too.

    It's entirely possible they'll just be smacked around and lose here and I think the mooks' designs are distractingly derivative and not that good, but this arc has some really nice scenarios set up and I really hope they'll be taken advantage of in a interesting way.
    I'm fully expecting Gohan's powers to get copied: even though he said seven-three is already strong without copying powers, Jaco is basically worried about that aspect of his, what with the "hold up for 30 minutes and he'll be back to normal", which makes it sound like his base strength is something Piccolo can take care of. Also, Gohan is stronger than Piccolo, so if seven-three attacks with Piccolo's techniques at exactly Piccolo's strength, Gohan can take that. So, yeah, if this fight has to become a challenge, Gohan's powers & strength need to be copied.

    (Which, btw...isn't that a bit too overpowered? So this guy could try and grab, say, Beerus' neck by surprise, and he'd have his techniques at his exact level of strength + infinite stamina for 30 minutes? Wouldn't that be more than enough time to wipe out the entire protagonist roster, Goku & Vegeta included?).

    The other thing I'm wondering is: Vegeta said that without the Moro powerup, Saganbo, the leader of the thugs, could be defeated by the likes of Trunks. Question: are the thugs perpetually powered up by Moro? Or only when he's physically near them & actively buffing them? Cause this seven-three guy just defeated Piccolo, and he's Saganbo's underling, which in Shonen logic means he's weaker than him? I guess? Are these three thugs powered up right now, or is this their base strength?

    Edit: And btw, I know it was probably just another cheap shot at him, but I'll admit it right here and now, when Krillin said "...should we contact Yamcha?", even if it was just for a millisecond, I had hope that maybe, just maybe, they'd give Yamcha of all people something to do. I mean, hell, Mr. Satan is there and was about to join the fight! Of course it was instantly shoved aside and forgotten by the very next panel. Damn it.
    Last edited by kouch_lee; October 21st, 2019 at 01:13 AM.

  6. #4626
    Rebecca is my Waifu~ Thatanas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post
    So this guy could try and grab, say, Beerus' neck by surprise
    Sure, he could try. I'm sure that'll end well for him, lol.

  7. #4627

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post

    Edit: And btw, I know it was probably just another cheap shot at him, but I'll admit it right here and now, when Krillin said "...should we contact Yamcha?", even if it was just for a millisecond, I had hope that maybe, just maybe, they'd give Yamcha of all people something to do.
    That's nice Tien is all about making sure Yamcha stays safe, Krillin as all about potentially wanting Yamcha to get his shit fucked up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  8. #4628

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Jaco mentions that all the strong fighters should be gathered, so in the best case scenario everyone might get something.

    OG73-1 sounds like a good opponent for the androids, too.

  9. #4629

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Well, if the entire bandit gang will end up having an individual fight, according to this image there's at least 10 discernible guys, counting Saganbo. Three of them are on Earth having individual fights atm, maybe the other 7 will receive the same treatment? That would be cool, indeed.

  10. #4630

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post
    (Which, btw...isn't that a bit too overpowered? So this guy could try and grab, say, Beerus' neck by surprise, and he'd have his techniques at his exact level of strength + infinite stamina for 30 minutes? Wouldn't that be more than enough time to wipe out the entire protagonist roster, Goku & Vegeta included?).
    This is Dragonball. Bit too overpowered is the name of the game. ANd not really any different from what Buu did back when he was absorbing people.

    Also, as powerful as Beerus is, Goku and Vegeta seem to have basically caught up to him as of the ToP. They might not be able to easily take him out, or even necessarily beat him at all, but they can strain to match him. Blue Kaioken is up there, and Blue Blue Vegeta is strong, considering how Toppo and Jiren were both considered at or above God level, and they basically flat out stated Ultra instinct is God level...

    In a serious full out fight they might not quite beat Beerus, but they could certainly hold him for half an hour at this point. And things being how they are, in such a serious fight they'd get stronger in the course of it.

    Now, Whis on the other hand...
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  11. #4631

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    This is Dragonball. Bit too overpowered is the name of the game. ANd not really any different from what Buu did back when he was absorbing people.

    Also, as powerful as Beerus is, Goku and Vegeta seem to have basically caught up to him as of the ToP. They might not be able to easily take him out, or even necessarily beat him at all, but they can strain to match him. Blue Kaioken is up there, and Blue Blue Vegeta is strong, considering how Toppo and Jiren were both considered at or above God level, and they basically flat out stated Ultra instinct is God level...

    In a serious full out fight they might not quite beat Beerus, but they could certainly hold him for half an hour at this point. And things being how they are, in such a serious fight they'd get stronger in the course of it.

    Now, Whis on the other hand...
    Yeah, they're probably able to hold Beerus off at this point (doubt they can even touch Whis, though), and it's also true that Buu did have a ton of bullshit on his arsenal. The thing is, this pseudo-android guy is introduced as "one of many" underlings, which were basically disregarded as weaklings by Vegeta during their first encounter if not for Moro's buffs, and yet he has such an overpowered ability - not so much copying techniques, but being able to use them at "the exact level of strength of its original user". This guy could throw a genki dama at SSGSS Goku's strength, and he's a nobody. That's what weirds me out a bit...

    ...but yeah, Dragonball has always had some strangely overpowered abilities on guys that, at the end of the day, have been pretty much throwaway characters (turning anyone into a carrot with a single touch? making anyone not named Goku explode from within with a single beam? stopping time?). So, I guess I'm blowing this out of proportion.

    Now, I hope some other of these galactic bandits has something interesting to show, or maybe this guy is their ace in the hole?

  12. #4632
    Under The Bridge Ageless_Bum's Avatar
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post
    Yhe has such an overpowered ability - not so much copying techniques, but being able to use them at "the exact level of strength of its original user". This guy could throw a genki dama at SSGSS Goku's strength, and he's a nobody. That's what weirds me out a bit...
    If the normal flow of defeating such abilities is followed he will copy someone like Gohan and use his powers for a chapter only to get weak all of the sudden and it will be explained that he may be able to use the abilities at the exact level of the original user, but his body is not strong enough to keep up if those powers are beyond his current physical level.
    Life flows on. I'd just go with it if I were me.

  13. #4633

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post
    This guy could throw a genki dama at SSGSS Goku's strength, and he's a nobody. That's what weirds me out a bit...
    Genki dama is a charge up technique that requires donations from others. He really shouldn't be able to do *that* one. Kamehameha, Kienzan or solar flare or beam canon or whatever, sure, but the spirit bomb should be off limits.

    Similarly, Kaio-ken and the strain it creates shouldn't be something instantly handled. (It was the problem Ginyu ran into when he straight up stole Goku's actual body.)
    , when Krillin said "...should we contact Yamcha?", even if it was just for a millisecond, I had hope that maybe, just maybe, they'd give Yamcha of all people something to do
    I always root for Yamcha to do something. But, the series decided he was retired back during Buu, and has decided he's a flat out joke meme now, so I can't see it happening. Even Tien is just sort of token "we don't know what to do with this guy but he's serious and used to be Goku's equal so I guess we should acknowledge he exists"...

    Even though they freaking traing with Kaio. They really, REALLY should have pulled Kaioken variants out of their asses somewhere along the way. Like, don't keep up with Super Saiyan quite, but use it enough that your body gets used to it and they can do Kaio-kenx100 while Goku can only manage x20. (Or rename it the Dodon-Ken or Tri-Ken or in Yamcha's case, Kaio-Fang-Fist or something to show its a variant with different strengths and weaknesses)
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  14. #4634

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    I recently rewatched the new Broly movie and I really do like the new Broly.

    I've seen a bunch of complaints about how he has only like 3 lines in the movie, but I like that his character is more expressed through his actions and feel like that makes him pretty unique in the cast.

    You learn a whole lot by just looking at his reactions and expressions. Aside from everything else, old Broly was a pretty expressionless meatheap even in his normal form. That might've been the point, but I feel definitely not in a good way.

  15. #4635

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    So now Trunks is getting Super Saiyan God mode, seriously can anyone outside of Saiyans get a god damn power up, give Piccolo, Tien, Krillen and Yamcha some love guys seriously

  16. #4636

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    Even though they freaking traing with Kaio. They really, REALLY should have pulled Kaioken variants out of their asses somewhere along the way. Like, don't keep up with Super Saiyan quite, but use it enough that your body gets used to it and they can do Kaio-kenx100 while Goku can only manage x20. (Or rename it the Dodon-Ken or Tri-Ken or in Yamcha's case, Kaio-Fang-Fist or something to show its a variant with different strengths and weaknesses)
    Giving them the Kaio-Ken was such an obvious thing to do, the fact Toriyama didn't go through with it is either: A - he found no use for it (could they have dealed with Gero or 19 thanks to the Kaio-Ken? Or Cyborg-Freeza and his dad? Probably not, so why bother?) B - Imagine Tien, Yamcha and, hell, even Chaotzu learning their own Kaio-ken variants, and meanwhile Krillin has learnt fuck-all. Krillin is the de-facto "human protagonist" of the series, because he's Goku's best friend, he's one of the most relatable, and all that. Suddenly having Yamcha of all people being out of his league would "break the canon", I guess? (Even though they SHOULD be canonically stronger than Krillin after training for months with 10x Earth's gravity).

    Or, C - He didn't even think about it. Which seems the most logical, considering Toriyama forgets shit all the time.

    But man I'd kill to see a Kaio-Fang-Fist.

    BTW, on a side note: The way villains with underlings / sub-bosses in Dragon Ball have always been treated is just so underwhelming. Always used to make Goku look mega-strong, nothing else. Baba's tournament? By the time a semi-competent fighter enters the ring (the Mummy man), Krillin is already out and Yamcha gets beaten to a pulp instantly, and it's Goku time for the next 3 fights. The ENTIRETY of the Red Ribbon saga, what with all its (existing/potential) generals and whatnot? Taken on almost single-handedly by Goku. Except for that one minion defeated by Yajirobe, Goku took every named villain during the King Piccolo saga. Namek had like 10 named underlings...ALL taken out by either Vegeta or Goku. ALL OF THEM. They couldn't even give Gohan or Krillin the win against Gurdo, or, hell, make them fight a piece of crap like Appule. And post-Namek, villains stopped having beatable underlings (if any underling at all) by anyone not Super Saiyan or Super Namekian. That's a shame.

  17. #4637

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by kouch_lee View Post
    and meanwhile Krillin has learnt fuck-all. Krillin is the de-facto "human protagonist" of the series, because he's Goku's best friend, he's one of the most relatable, and all that. Suddenly having Yamcha of all people being out of his league would "break the canon", I guess?
    Krillin got the potential unlock on Namek. He could have stayed ahead based on that. Or, eventually learned his own version. Everyone can do the kamehammeha and solar flare, they can trade other techniques.

    It's almost certainly because Toriyama just forgot on the road to SUper Saiyan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Green_vs_Red View Post
    Think you meant 8, who beat White after Toriyama decided to make Goku look like an idiot so he could get cheapshotted leading to 8 one shotting him.
    He was clearly talking about the Piccollo saga in the line you cut in half.
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  18. #4638

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Rereading it yeah it wasn't a mistake, whoops.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  19. #4639

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Now that you mention it, Yamcha never doing a Spirit Ball/Bomb combo with Goku seems like a major missed opportunity.
    Complicating things since 2009.

  20. #4640

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    He was clearly talking about the Piccollo saga in the line you cut in half.
    I was, but I gotta admit I totally forgot about 8 being the one to defeat White, so he was right.

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